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View Full Version : Possible group buy for CNC hydraulic e-brakes



Chromedragon
04-07-2006, 01:51 PM
I'm not sure how many people would be interested in these for drifting, but they are far stronger and easier to use than a stock cable type brake.

Click to see what I'm talking about (http://cncbrakes.com/cncbrakes.com-asp//hsb.asp?grp=hsb&subgrp=all&series=412&subseries=)

It's actually designed to brake the front wheels of drag cars for staging and burnouts, but many people have used them with good success in drift cars, including the Techno Toy Tuning orange Corolla coupe.

I haven't contacted CNC directly about pricing, but a site that was reselling them had them listed at $99.40 US. I'm hoping that we can knock that down to $80 US from CNC directly if we order at least 10.

I myself plan on keeping my stock e-brake as well so that I can still use it when parking. Here is a shot of how T3 had planned to mount theirs. I am hoping put mine mounted low on the passenger side of the transmission tunnel, right beside the shifter.

http://www.technotoytuning.com/misc/AlsCAR/newcar72.jpg

Anyhow, if anyone is interested just post up. I'll be back in town on the 15th, so I'll contact CNC when I get back.

garagefujimoto
04-07-2006, 02:50 PM
$80 is way better that rates I have seen with other re-sellers.
I would be down.

Are the fittings metric?
If not I guess we need to make some new lines

scofa
04-07-2006, 05:05 PM
i'd be down for one too.. my cable one keeps sticking. and i am not planning on daily driving my car much more anyhow so one would be fine.. Also i am going to be running my lines inside and will have a proportioning valve soon too.

Chromedragon
04-07-2006, 06:38 PM
I think we will need new lines at some point anyhow. Since the lines will have to run into the cab we won't be able to just cut the present line and flare new fittings on, extra length will need to come from somewhere.

I will ask about getting metric versions of the brake though. I'm guessing that they shouldn't have any problem doing so. All it would take is a different drill and thread tap.

Anyone know what size the brake thread fittings are on the Corolla off hand? I figure the way to go would just be to buy two separate lines to replace the whole rear brake line all the way back to the soft line connection at the rear diff. Hard lines are cheap, cheap.

Noir
04-07-2006, 08:00 PM
I need to run new lines to get my car running, so as long as this is done soon I'm in.

- Zack

Selica81
04-07-2006, 10:37 PM
................for $80.00,count me in...........providing they fit an 81 Celica

Vince

point dexter
04-07-2006, 11:21 PM
Sure why not!

-Jay

coreworld
04-08-2006, 01:20 AM
Id be in too!

Chromedragon
04-16-2006, 10:17 PM
I will be contacting these guys this week about getting a buy going.

Right now we have 7 people, I'll find out how many they want for a good price and what price we can actually get. I will also pass this on to some other boards once I find out a bit more information on pricing and shipping.

1. Chromedragon
2. Garagefujimoto
3. Scofa
4. Noir
5. Selica81
6. Pointdexter
7. Coreworld
8.
9.
10.
11.
12.
13.
14
15.

ahyc84
04-16-2006, 11:01 PM
are you just suppose to hook that up directly to the rear hydraulic brake lines?
Wouldn't that make the rear brakes non functional during normal braking?
I'm assuming these has nothing to do with the ebrake cable line?

sry, never looked up any info on these in my life.:D

scofa
04-16-2006, 11:11 PM
i noticed on their site there is a staging brake and a hand brake.. Do we get a choice in which one we want. both would work for a hand brake. just depends on if you want a seperate master cylinder for you hand brake or not..

Chromedragon
04-17-2006, 10:50 AM
Everything that I have seen in drift cars is their staging brake. By using this you still have normal braking action when you step on the pedal, where as I think that the e-brake would force pressure into the whole system if you didn't have some sort of check valve.

Maybe someone could clear this up? This is what it looks like to me anyhow. If you just tee into the rear brake line it would send pressure towards the master cylinder as well, I'm not sure if the pressure would stop there, or if it would feed into the regular braking system, possibly affecting the front brakes as well or even forcing fluid into the master cylinder?

here are the diagrams to show the difference between the brakes. Top is the staging brake, bottom is the standard hand brake.

http://cncbrakes.com/cncbrakes.com-asp//images/412-dim.jpg

http://cncbrakes.com/cncbrakes.com-asp//images/402-dim.jpg

ahyc84
04-17-2006, 05:37 PM
ya does anyone have any proper diagram in how the system would work before i'm in for sure?

pretty interested in this. Just want to know how it hooks up and such. And how do you T hard brake lines? or r we talking about SS lines?

scofa
04-17-2006, 06:34 PM
From what i know and have seen, basically you take your rear brake line that runs off the proportioning valave that sits right by your master cylinder in the engine bay. Scap that line from there all the way to the back of the car where it hooks up to the soft line at the axle. re-bend a new line that will come inside the car, go through the handbrake like it's not even there (untill you use it) and runs back of the car where it will exit and then hook back up the to the axle where it used to. And if you really want to have some fun you can ditch the stock proportioning valve and in the line going to the back of the car before the hand brake you can put a brake bias controller.
If i am completely wrong with this then someone correct me, but thats the way i have helped hook them up in my friends Rally car. And it works

Basically use this diagram but swap the front and rear brakes in there.
http://cncbrakes.com/cncbrakes.com-asp//images/412-dim.jpg

Chromedragon
04-17-2006, 07:05 PM
Yeah I should have mentioned that. The diagram there shows the setup for locking the front wheels on a drag car for burnouts and staging. We would run it the opposite way. For this you would just run the rear hard line right through the staging brake.

ahyc84
04-17-2006, 09:29 PM
ahhh it all makes sense now :o

another question arised from this though. Since each corner runs on a completely seperate brake line, having this install would mean the rear brakes have to run on the same line ?
cuz i don't see 2 nipple on hydraulic pump:e

oh and when you talk to them, just ask what prices can they give for groupbuys with however many amount of people we can reach. ask them to give you like a list or something. Cuz most groupbuys can knock off more then 20% off the retail price from what i've seen heh

Chromedragon
04-17-2006, 11:17 PM
You have a single line running to the rear brakes that splits once it reaches the rear axle.

If people are doing this handbrake I would definitely recommend getting stainless steel lines. Not only will it help the system work much better, it will be much safer as well.

I will ask about group buy prices for different group sizes for sure. I'll be calling tomorrow.

Jover
04-17-2006, 11:34 PM
If I can be part of this group buy in about 2-4 weeks, i'm down... I just got paid and paid out. So me broke.

ahyc84
04-17-2006, 11:37 PM
You have a single line running to the rear brakes that splits once it reaches the rear axle.

If people are doing this handbrake I would definitely recommend getting stainless steel lines. Not only will it help the system work much better, it will be much safer as well.

I will ask about group buy prices for different group sizes for sure. I'll be calling tomorrow.
ya well....i'm not using this on a ae86 haha

this would be going on a FC. I have 4 different lines from what i can see on my fsm:(
i can probably just run them in to one then split in to 2 again lol. I hope?
i can't really understand the idea behind bending the stock hardlines to make this work. That's quite unsafe imo

Chromedragon
04-18-2006, 01:19 AM
ya well....i'm not using this on a ae86 haha

this would be going on a FC. I have 4 different lines from what i can see on my fsm:(
i can probably just run them in to one then split in to 2 again lol. I hope?
i can't really understand the idea behind bending the stock hardlines to make this work. That's quite unsafe imo
You could bend them, but it would be easier to just buy new ones and bend those. With a proper line bender it's perfectly safe.

Chromedragon
04-18-2006, 11:40 AM
Alright, I just spoke with Max over at the Chassis Shop and got some details about the brakes and pricing.

First off, the price in their online catalog is out of date. The current price is $113.40 US for the staging brake. I told him that we might have quite a few people for a group buy and he said if we bring him a decent sized group he'll definitely work the price down.

As for the mechanics of the brake. The outlet and inlet on the brake are 1/8" pipe thread, so essentially whatever adapter you might need to work with your brakes should be available. It would be best to find out what size fittings we need for each vehicle as they should have them for us. I know we have a 10mm wrench size on the fittings on Corollas, but I'm not positive what the actual size and thread pitch is on the brake fitting itself.

I guess with that price there we probably won't get $80US unless we get like 100 people in for the group buy, but we should be able to do under $100 with 20 people. So tell your friends ... hell, tell your enemies! I'll be posting this up on a few other forums to get some more interest going.

ahyc84
04-18-2006, 12:40 PM
wow, they either sell a lot of those very often or else they just don't have much markup on them at all
I'm assuming these are all gonna be shipped from the US, and send individually to each buyer?

micro214_kp61
04-18-2006, 02:10 PM
if the price stays under $100USD, i'm in..:D

Chromedragon
04-19-2006, 02:26 AM
That will be the plan. Obviously shipping is on top of the price as well here. If we have several people living in one area that are ordering we can probably save a few bucks by shipping to one person and then just distributing from there.

Payment is something else we'll have to figure out. I'm guessing these guys would take direct credit card payments, but if people prefer I could probably do something through Paypal as well.

erix7
04-22-2006, 03:18 PM
i'll take 3..

ahyc84
04-22-2006, 05:39 PM
alright figured the **** out. Found an extra hardline on the car i can cut up for this :D some previouse emission crap or something hahaha


count me in as long as it's cheaper then retail

Chromedragon
04-23-2006, 05:53 AM
Updated list for DK users

1. Chromedragon
2. Garagefujimoto
3. Scofa
4. Noir
5. Selica81
6. Pointdexter
7. Coreworld
8. ahyc84
9. driftstar.com
10. micro214_kp61
11. erix7 (1)
12. erix7 (2)
13. erix7 (3)
14
15.

This is a great start guys. Please feel free to pass the word on to other boards, club members, friends, dogs, random homeless people that enjoy drifting, etc.

ahyc84
04-23-2006, 11:14 AM
Updated list for DK users

1. Chromedragon - Edmonton, AB
2. Garagefujimoto - Lethbridge
3. Scofa - Calgary, AB
4. Noir - Winnipeg, MN
5. Selica81 - Coquitlam, BC
6. Pointdexter - Winnipeg, MN
7. Coreworld - Nelson, BC
8. ahyc84 - Richmond, BC
9. driftstar.com - ????
10. micro214_kp61 - Toronto, ON
11. erix7 (1) - Quebec
12. erix7 (2)
13. erix7 (3)
14
15.

This is a great start guys. Please feel free to pass the word on to other boards, club members, friends, dogs, random homeless people that enjoy drifting, etc.


Added the city to make things more convient
Chromedragon, could you find out from the distributor whether shipping will be a lot more when it's shipped over the border from the states?
cuz if it's a lot more, i'm just gonna have it shipped to my friend's place in Everett, WA. Someone i know comes back and forth from Everett weekly. Save on the duty also:D

Chromedragon
04-23-2006, 12:01 PM
Thanks for that. I can check with them, but I'm not sure if they'll know about actual duty costs at all though.

One way that we'll likely be able to save is shipping to one person in each locale and then distributing from there. Unfortunately, for the moment anyhow, it looks as though we only have two interested people in the same location, and it's Winnipeg of all places.

canadianskyline
04-23-2006, 01:23 PM
I will purchase one if its down around 100 usd. And i could get mine shipped to lethbridge with garagefujimoto.

ahyc84
04-23-2006, 02:35 PM
Thanks for that. I can check with them, but I'm not sure if they'll know about actual duty costs at all though.

One way that we'll likely be able to save is shipping to one person in each locale and then distributing from there. Unfortunately, for the moment anyhow, it looks as though we only have two interested people in the same location, and it's Winnipeg of all places.


actually, me and "Selica81 - Coquitlam, BC" would be considered the same city. It's a sub city within the Greater Vancouver Area since it's so big. We're only about 30min away and i often drive in to coquitlam. So if he trust me i could just drop it off at his place, or vice versa since i don't ever post on here much

that is, if i don't go and cheap out on duty :P
duty and tax is 20% of the item's value

Skylinelover
04-23-2006, 07:16 PM
I will probally get one depending on price. When will we find out how much?

Chromedragon
04-23-2006, 11:20 PM
Can't say for sure. I'll give him another call this week and find out what he can do for different numbers of people.

ahyc84
04-24-2006, 01:38 AM
so um i found these
http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=933

so we're going for the straight handle ones?
how does the angled handle ones look like?

erix7
04-24-2006, 08:53 AM
nice deal CBperformance , i'll take the CB they are cheap..

Chromedragon
04-24-2006, 11:02 AM
I haven't seen any with an angled handle at all before. I'm assuming that there has to be a reason that it's $15 cheaper though. Maybe no knob? or it's not as strong as the straight handle?

Seeing that price is good though, will allow me to negotiate better with Chassis Shop.:D

ahyc84
04-29-2006, 01:15 AM
any updates?

would the angle handle ones be the pic you posted on the first page? lol
http://www.technotoytuning.com/misc/AlsCAR/newcar72.jpg

i mean, that handle is angled. I'm still not sure how that handle in the picture works. The pivotal point of the stick doesn't look like it'll function very well with the 90 degree bend

Chromedragon
04-29-2006, 12:16 PM
I guess that would be it. I'm not sure why it would be $15 cheaper though?

pitobread
04-29-2006, 02:10 PM
http://www.technotoytuning.com/misc/AlsCAR/newcar90.jpg

T3 modded their handle to work gooder.

Chromedragon
04-29-2006, 11:43 PM
Uhhhh, wtf. I would be terrified of snapping that off every time that I pulled it.:eek:

ahyc84
04-30-2006, 09:48 PM
if it's welded on, why worry?

i think this might be as much participant we're gonna get for a while. so how'bout some update now :D

maybe even contact CB?

SalEsh
05-03-2006, 07:44 AM
am i a little late???? :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby:

count me in if not!!!


Brandon

ahyc84
05-03-2006, 01:14 PM
as far as i know, no

i haven't got any update on these yet

bmx269
05-03-2006, 04:29 PM
I am interested for sure. Let me know. Also what is the difference between angled and straight?

-Trent

ahyc84
05-03-2006, 05:43 PM
oh ****
hey Trent, adrian here

look on the 1st and 2nd page. has info on straight and angled

C_Suzuki
05-03-2006, 05:57 PM
what are the advantages of the hydraullic ebrake compared to a regular ebrake?

ahyc84
05-08-2006, 11:17 PM
regular cable ebrake doesn't really lock up that easily when you're going fast enough, or if you have big tires\wheels in the back.
Hydraulic would lock up with very little effort

bmx269
05-09-2006, 03:51 PM
Adrian,

Got that FC drifting yet?? What happened to D----EA?

I want this now... I would even pay full pop.

-Trent

jymz
05-10-2006, 06:49 PM
Can we buy these yet?
Anyone local? Mopac has a wilwood one.

Chromedragon
05-11-2006, 12:24 AM
Sorry guys, I have been really busy here. I'll give them a call on Friday and see what each company will do for price inc. shipping to different cities.

ahyc84
05-11-2006, 06:22 PM
k ya, this is gonna really depend on the pricing of the GB

found something better as jymz's info on the wilwood got me to search up some other options

Just incase anyone wants to know

http://www.wilwood.com/Products/006-MasterCylinders/007-KJDMC/index.asp
$78.78 usd retail
this one is designed for karts, so i'm not 100% sure if I'll trust it so much locking up 17" wheels at 110km/h. If it blows up on me, i'd have no rear brakes. This is the same as the "hand brake" by CNC, it has the reservior on it. The problem with this one is that fluids could be forced back to your brake master cylinder. Which isn't very good. Requires you to make a bracket and bolt on a handle

http://www.wilwood.com/Products/006-MasterCylinders/004-CRRMC/index.asp
$51.78 usd retail.
This one is actually designed for such application, only thing is you gotta fab the entire assembly around it. probably about $20 of metal. Use a lot of rivets if you can't weld haha:D

or we can always try and contact a machinery place to machine all the brackets in a big group buy. This would mean noobs should steer clear from this though

ahyc84
06-04-2006, 06:49 PM
so is this dead or what? cuz if it is, i'm gonna go make\buy my own

bmx269
06-05-2006, 08:18 AM
I got sick of waiting. I ordered the KSport one.

Here are some pictures.
http://www.ksportusa.com/products/images/ebrake_1.jpg
http://www.ksportusa.com/products/images/ebrake_2.jpg
http://www.ksportusa.com/products/images/ebrake_3.jpg

http://www.apexperformance.co.uk/catalog/images/hand.jpg

-Trent

Chromedragon
06-05-2006, 01:35 PM
****, sorry guys. I've been so busy with my turbo setup and work that I forgot all about this. I've contacted KSport and CB Performance now and hopefully will hear back soon in case anyone is interested in their brakes, and I have called and left a message with Max at The Chassis Shop and should hear back pretty soon.

Chromedragon
06-06-2006, 01:35 PM
Alright, I spoke with Max at the Chassis Shop again and he essentially said the way for us to get the best price is to become a dealer by buying at least $1,000 in product off the bat. Even still, with that we would get a dealer price of $107, pretty disappointing to say the least at only $7 off (although their prices may have recently gone up like everyone else).

Since this is the best they'll give us I'll talk to some others. I got a price of $180 for the KSport handbrakes from Imageinmotion in the lower mainland. While this is a little more, their unit looks a little more user friendly and we will pay less shipping/duties.

Honestly though, as it sits the group buy from Chassis Shop is somewhat pointless if that's all they're willing to knock off.

Answ3r
11-20-2008, 10:02 AM
I know I'm digging up a really old thread, but I am looking at making one, but I can't seem to figure what fittings to use, and Ksport lines at 190$ are out of question.

http://www.wilwood.com/Products/006-MasterCylinders/004-CRRMC/dwg.gif

The 3/8-24 is okay, this is standard brake like fitting, and I guess there is a taper in the bottom, but what about the 7/16-20 ??

bmx269
11-20-2008, 11:55 AM
It took me a few different places to find Metric brake line fittings. When I found a place that carried them, it was quick. I also added a sort of purge area, to allow better bleeding of the system.

note the pic:
http://i449.photobucket.com/albums/qq214/bmx269/ae86/DSCF0123.jpg
http://i449.photobucket.com/albums/qq214/bmx269/ae86/DSCF0122.jpg

-Trent

dano
11-20-2008, 12:18 PM
^ ebrake looks good! does anyone have any more info on other ebrake setups?

Answ3r
11-20-2008, 03:23 PM
BMX269, can you list the exact fitting you used ? And is there a taper in the master cylinder or are the threads taper ?

BenR
11-20-2008, 04:59 PM
DO NOT USE THE WRONG FITTINGS. there are metric, and then standard(like willwood), japanese standard (thats us) and european standard... go to a fittings store make sure someone who knows what they are doing sells/makes you some lines. i will post up my setup this weekend, it took me an hour and didnt leak!

Rastaracer
11-20-2008, 11:52 PM
I've got the k-sport one as well (not yet installed),so I'll be keeping an eye on this thread.

BenR
11-21-2008, 06:41 AM
here is a diagram and i will take some photos and post them this weekend along with some instructions

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q72/AE86ben/Black%20Car/hydroebrakesetup.jpg

Rastaracer
11-21-2008, 06:48 AM
That looks too easy...is that all there is to it? Which brake biased did you use, and where did you get it from? Oh and residual valve...where do I pick up one of those?

Dugwillis
11-21-2008, 11:19 AM
so whats the deal with the group buy? I need 2 of these.

Chromedragon
11-21-2008, 11:55 AM
This is like 27 years old. I bought a K-Sport unit about 24 years ago because not enough people showed interest.

Answ3r
11-21-2008, 10:45 PM
The point is NOT about how to plumb it, but rather what fitting you need to fit the master cylider.

BenR
11-22-2008, 12:48 AM
That looks too easy...is that all there is to it? Which brake biased did you use, and where did you get it from? Oh and residual valve...where do I pick up one of those?

ya its easy. used all willwood stuff. lordco can get them and A FITTINGS STORE CAN SELL YOU THE RIGHT FITTINGS

Answ3r
11-26-2008, 04:02 PM
What size cylinder did you buy ?

bmx269
11-26-2008, 09:08 PM
get a 5/8 one, I am using a 3/4" and with the supra rear end's brakes it is good, but with the stock ae ones, the smaller one makes more force...

-Trent

BenR
12-03-2008, 08:53 PM
plumed just like the diagram. i have no picture of the residual valve but its pretty simple. remove the rear brake lines from the stock brake bias/distribution block on the inner fender. cut the flares off the ends of the stock lines, slip the apropriate fitting onto the line, and re-flare the line. then install the residual valve in the rear line where the stock brake bias/distribution block used to be.

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q72/AE86ben/Black%20Car/IMG_0682.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q72/AE86ben/Black%20Car/IMG_0683.jpg

works awesome.

liam75
12-03-2008, 09:03 PM
works awesome.

What you should have said is works awesome when plumbed in right.
Picture this its nearly 12am, you've been at work since 8am and you cant seem to bleed the brakes properly in your friends new sweet brake setup.
Oh wait the LINES ARE ON BACKWARDS.
*ahem*
Now as Ben said its fairly straight forward once you get all the fittings sorted out. That and you can yank it as hard as you want and it wont break.