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Thread: Write-up: Celica-Supra (MA45/46/47) differential swap & info.

  1. #1
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    Write-up: Celica-Supra (MA45/46/47) differential swap & info.

    MA46/MA47 Celica-Supra rear axle into AE86 swap. Write up & a lot of other related information.


    Before I start I just wanted to give a massive THANK YOU to Jon (Jonnie Fraz of http://www.stealth-custom-fab.com) for all his help & hardwork on the axle housing.


    FYI: there are several ways to do this swap. This just happens to be the way I wanted it done. You can do it with much less work by using a longer panhard & also different control arms &/or bushings/heims with the larger 14mm ID to match the celica-supra rear end bolt size. For instance T3 makes a 'bolt-in' 4-link & Lateral bar kit, it would mean you would only have to swap spring seats.


    1. The axle housings I'll be using, two will have the mounts removed to make into one (SR5 & MA46) and one extra to build/verify the jig with (GTS).


    2. Here you can see how close in length the axle housings are.


    The MA46/MA47 is only a total of 15mm longer than both AE86 ones (which are the same length).


    3. In this pic you can see the spring seats are different sizes, the lateral bar/panhard mount is positioned differently. Whats harder to tell in the picture is that the upper mounts are spread about 1-2" wider apart on the MA46/MA47 axle housing compared to the AE86.


    4. Here's a side view of the SR5 & MA46/MA47 lower mounts. As you can see they are fairly similar, but the bolt holes & openings are different sizes. I'll be swapping all 4 upper & lower mounts from the AE86 axle housing to the MA46/MA47.


    5. Building the jig off of the GT-S axle housing.




    6. Marshmellows anyone? Ready to cut off the AE86 SR-5 housing mounts as well as the MA46 mounts.


    7. Cutting off the mounts from the AE86 SR-5 housing.


    8. Stripped AE86 SR-5 housing. You can see the spring seats and mounts to be used on the MA46/MA47 axle housing laying on the ground to the right of the housing.


    9. Cutting off the mounts from the MA46/MA47 housing.


    10. The MA46/MA47 housing w/the mounts cut off. Welds ground flat, and laying in the jig getting ready to tack the AE86 mounts to it.


    11. Fitting the mounts and tacking everything on.


    12. Everything was good so it was time to weld.


    13. Mmm, good beads. (no cleanup/slag removed in this pic. undoctored)


    14. Housing is done, gave it a fresh coat of paint.


    15. Housing mounted in the car, pretty much a perfect fit so far. Used the MA46/MA47 brake hard lines with some minor bending/rerouting at the ends to meet the AE86 backing plates. The AE86 center brake line threads & fits just fine. The Energy Suspension bushings fit perfect for mounting the swaybar (super snug).


    16. 3rd member installed, you can see the steel braided brake line for the AE86 threaded into the diff side. Brakes are still capped off until I get the calipers on and get to bleed everything.


    17. Axles & AE86 brake backing plates installed.


    18. Installed my driveshaft, and exactly as I calculated based on housing/3rd members the driveshaft had be shortened 21mm or 13/16".


    19. Installed my rotors, caliper brackets and calipers. Bled the brake system and adjusted the e-brake.


    NOTE: The only problem I really ran into doing this whole swap, I found someone had installed different wheel studs than factory, it had some 12 x 1.0mm threaded studs as opposed to the normal 12 x 1.5mm. So I had to take my brakes back off and run to the parts store & get new studs. Installed the new correct thread pitch studs, filled the diff, put my wheels and tires on the car and went for a spin. Runs and drives fine, axle housing is centered like it should be. Good to go (I hope).

    __________________________________________________ ________________


    Miscellaneous other pictures, most related to the swap, and also related to the information found in the post below.

    Here's a picture of the MA46/MA47 (black) sway bar bracket & Energy suspension swaybar bracket that came with their bushing kit. You can see the difference in width of the bracket (32.4mm MA46/MA47, & 30mm Energy Susp.). I shaved that extra 2.4mm off with a belt sander and bevelled the edges so it wont cut into the bushing. They fit the swaybar, housing & bracket perfectly.


    The brake calipers for both the AE86 GT-S & MA46/MA47. The AE86 Park/E-brake cables clip right into the MA46/MA47 calipers with no issues, meaning you can use the MA46/MA47 brakes on the AE86 pretty easily.


    The backing plates are very similar. The designs of them are slightly different for the 2 different brake caliper brackets. And that the MA46/MA47 backing plate/dust shield is slightly larger for the MA46/MA47 rotors which are 1" larger in diameter.


    Brake pads are pretty similar in dimensions, obviously the largest difference is the MA46/MA47 pads are straight across the bottom resulting in a 7mm larger contact patch. But the MA46/MA47 pads are sadly lacking in selection (afaik). Fortunately from how it looks you can use AE86 pads with the MA46/MA47 calipers.


    OEM toyota bearings, seals & housing gasket purchased to rebuild differential.
    Last edited by assassin10000; 07-10-2008 at 03:29 PM.

  2. #2
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    Chassis & Differential Codes of the Vehicles I'm using parts from.
    MA46/MA47: F312 - For axle housing, 3rd member, axles.
    MA67 ____ : F283 - For 4.3 gear set, and possibly LSD options for it.
    AE86 (GT-S): T282 - For replacement solid pinion spacer (TRD part) & brakes (calipers/mounts/pads).
    AE86 (SR-5): S074 - For axle housing mounts & spring seats.

    Axle Housing Information.
    1. Axle housing ends/Backing plate bolt pattern is the same for both AE86 GT-S & MA46/MA47.
    2. Drain/Fill plugs are the same thread/size (interchangeable) as they are for most Toyota?s. So is the differential vent.
    3. Pinion Flange same bolt pattern. But will require shortening the driveshaft, or a shorter one.
    4. Axle housing lengths (actual backing plate flange).
    MA46/MA47 = 1290mm or 50 3/4" (approx.)
    AE86 (SR-5 & GT-S) = 1275mm or 50 1/4" (approx.)

    5. Sway bar mounts on the MA46/MA47 are the same distance apart as the AE86.
    6. Upper control arm mounts are spaced apart approx 32mm (+/- 1mm):
    MA46/MA47 = 521mm or 20.5"
    AE86 = 489mm or 19.25"

    7. Lower control arm mounts are spaced the same distance, but at different angle and position in relation to the housing.
    8. 4-link mount bolt hole diameters are different:
    MA46/MA47 = 14mm
    AE86 = 12mm

    9. Overall axle flange/wheel mounting face length (difference of approx 12mm):
    MA46/MA47 = 1404mm or 55 9/32" (approx.)
    AE86 = 1392mm or 54 25/32" (approx.)


    Axle Shaft Information.
    1. Axle flange bolt pattern:
    Both = 4 x 114.3mm (4 x 4.5")
    2. Axle spline Diameter:
    MA46/MA47 = 28mm
    AE86 = 24(Zenki) - 25.5mm (Kouki) approx.

    3. Axle spline count:
    MA46/MA47 = 27
    AE86 = 23

    4. Axle shaft diameter (main portion between splines & retainer):
    MA46/MA47 = 30mm
    AE86 = 26mm

    5. Axle flange/hub center size:
    Both = 60mm
    6. Axle flange outside diameter:
    MA46/MA47 = 139.4mm
    AE86 = 139.0mm

    7. Wheel bearings & retainers are the same for both MA46/MA47 & AE86 GT-S.

    Brake Rotors, Pads, and Calipers Information.
    1. Brake pads from an AE86 can be put on a MA46/MA47. But NOT the other way around. Because the AE86 brake pads are not as 'Tall' as the MA46/MA47 brake pads.
    2. Brake pad height difference:
    MA46/MA47 = 37mm
    AE86 = 30mm

    3. Brake Rotor overall height:
    Both = 48mm
    4. Rotor Hat thickness @ axle flange:
    MA46/MA47 = 5.4mm
    AE86 5.25mm

    5. Rotor Hat inner diameter:
    MA46/MA47 = 141.3mm
    AE86 = 139.7mm

    6. Rotor Hat outside diameter:
    Both = 159mm
    7. Rotor outside diameter:
    MA46/MA47 = 258mm
    AE86 = 231mm

    8. Rotor thickness:
    Both = 10.1 - 10.2mm
    9. Calipers, Bracket/Mounts, and Backing plates are different. But as a set, are swappable to either axle housing if using all the parts from either the AE86 or MA46/MA47 allowing you to run either MA46/MA47 or AE86 rear brakes on both axle housings.
    10. Calipers on both MA46/MA47 & AE86 use the same style Park/E-brake cable attachment.
    (Note: All measurements approx. AE86 rotors measured were aftermarket and may be slightly different than OEM.)


    OEM/Aftermarket LSD options
    For the US market little or no Celica-Supras had an OEM lsd equipped, where as in Canada most did come with an OEM lsd.

    There are many more options for LSD available for the MA46/MA47 Celica-Supra than most realize, here's several I figured out. They ALL require using different carrier bearings with a larger bearing I.D. to fit the carrier (see bearing info below). They must also be for a 7.5" F-series toyota diff and designed for 27 spline axles.
    1. OEM clutch type LSD from MKII 82-86 Celica-Supra's
    2. OEM Torsen (gear) LSD from the 'JDM' Altezza (sxe10/gxe10)
    3. Any aftermarket (Cusco, Kaaz, Tomei, AT-S, ect) LSD for the Toyota Car 7.5" differential (Chassis codes IE: MA6x MKII Celica-Supra, JZX90 Chaser (non-turbo), SXE10/GXE10 JDM IS200 Altezza w/Beams)
    4. Any aftermarket Locker or LSD for the front of the Toyota 4x4 pickups & 4-runners. (IE: Detroit Truetrac torsen LSD, Detroit Locker, ARB air locker, Powertrax Lock-right & No-slip)


    Aftermarket Sway Bar Bushing Information.
    As noted above (See: line 5 under 'Axle Housing Information'), the sway bar mounts on the Celica-Supra axle are the same distance apart as the AE86 rear axle. That means you are able to use the AE86 sway bars with the MA46/MA47 sway bar mounts & brackets. You just need the correctly sized bushings & a minor modifcation to do so.

    I found that the universal sway bar bushings from Energy Suspension (or Prothane possibly) should allow you to fit different size AE86 sway bars to the Celica-Supra rear axle sway bar mounts & brackets. I purchased one of the Energy Suspension kits and verified fitment with my AE86 sway bar. And found that the modification required of Celica-Supra sway bar bracket is to shave 2mm off the width of the bracket (1mm each side). For the bushing to fit correctly. (See picture #xx above.)

    Available Sizes & Part numbers.
    Energy Susp._| Prothane
    16mm 9.5120 | 19-1115
    17mm 9.5121 | 19-1116
    18mm 9.5122 | 19-1117
    19mm 9.5123 | 19-1118
    20mm 9.5124 | 19-1119
    21mm 9.5125 | 19-1120
    22mm 9.5126 | 19-1121
    23mm 9.5127 | 19-1122
    24mm 9.5128 | 19-1123
    25mm 9.5129 | 19-1124
    (Note: Better fit? | Not enough measurements found online. Need height/width/center?)

    Measurements of MA46/MA47 rear sway bar bushing bracket:
    Height = 31mm
    Length = 31mm
    Width = 32.3mm

    Metric conversion/Size notes for determining bushing (inches are approx.):
    31.0mm = 1.22" | 1-7/32"
    32.3mm = 1.27" | 1-17/64"
    20.0mm = 0.78" | 25/32"

  3. #3
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    Differential Setup Information.
    MK1 1979-1981 Celica-Supra F-series (solid) specifications:
    Ring Gear Backlash = 0.005-0.007" (.13-.18mm)
    Ring Gear Bolt Torque = 67-75 ft lbs
    Pinion Nut Torque = 80 ft lbs (to MAX of 173 ft lbs for crush sleeve)
    Pinion Bearing Preload = 7.9-ll.2 in lbs
    Carrier Bearing Cap Bolt Torque = 51-65 ft lbs (I go to 58 ft lbs)
    Total Preload = 3.5-5.2 in lbs (on top of/in addition to pinion preload)
    Axle/Backing Plate Nuts = 44-53 ft lbs.

    (Note: Thanks go to Chris Eng/CJSREDPRA at www.celicasupra.com for this info out of his '81 manual(s). Specifically the - Carina & Celica "Chassis" Publication # 98263E.)

    MK2 82-86 Celica Supra F-series (IRS) specifications:
    Ring Gear Backlash = 0.005-0.007" (.13-.18mm)
    Ring Gear Bolt Torque = 71 ft lbs
    Pinion Nut Torque = 80 ft lbs (to MAX of 174 ft lbs for crush sleeve)
    Pinion Bearing Preload = NEW 10.4-16.5 in lbs (12-19 kg cm) / USED 6.2-8.7 in lb (6-10 kg cm)
    Carrier Bearing Cap Bolt Torque = 58 ft lbs
    Total Preload = 3.5-5.2 in lbs (4-6 kg cm) - on top of/in addition to pinion preload

    (Note: Thanks go to cygnus-x1(?) of www.cygnusx1.net where I got the info from the MK2 TSRM.)

    95-04 2wd Tacoma/Truck rear axle F-series (solid) specifications:
    Ring Gear Backlash = 0.005-0.007" (.13-.18mm)
    Ring Gear Bolt Torque = 71 ft lbs
    Pinion Nut Torque = 80 ft lbs (to MAX of 174 ft lbs for crush sleeve)
    Pinion Bearing Preload = NEW 12.2-18.3 in lbs (14-21 kg cm) / USED 5.2-8.7 in lb (6-10 kg cm)
    Carrier Bearing Cap Bolt Torque = 63 ft lbs
    Total Preload = 3.5-5.2 in lbs (4-6 kg cm) - on top of/in addition to pinion preload


    Since the specs are so close, and there is a reason they changed as production went on. I'll probably just set it up to the newest 2wd Tacoma specs. The only real difference is that there is slightly more preload, but after the bearings wear in that'll be a non-issue.


    Toyota Part Numbers - Bearings & Seals.
    Key: *** means part # is same between MA46/MA47 and AE86.

    MA46/MA47 part numbers.
    90366-30022-77 | Front Pinion Bearing
    90366-35023-77 | Rear Pinion Bearing
    90368-45066-77 | Carrier Bearing (x2) w/o lsd
    90311-38047 | Pinion Seal w/o lsd
    41231-22010 | Crush Sleeve ***
    90311-52059 | Rear Axle Seals (x2) ***
    04421-30011 | Rear Axle Bearings (x2) ***
    90179-18001 | Pinion Nut ***

    90311-38010 | Pinion Seal w/lsd
    90368-50024 | Carrier Bearing (x2) w/lsd

    These part #'s below may be necessary to use an LSD in the F-series housing.
    MA6x part number.
    90368-45002 | Carrier Bearing (45mm I.D.)

    Tacoma/4-runner part number and information.
    90368-50006 | Carrier Bearing (50mm I.D.)
    Part # is from 1st gen Tacoma/2nd & 3rd gen 4-runners.
    (Note: All other bearings listed for the Tacoma/4runner front differential are different & not applicable to the RWD F-series differential. 2wd pickup/Tacoma/4-Runner rear differentials are 7.5" (except Tacoma Pre-runner) but some have different bearing part #'s than the 4wd front diff and MA46/MA47/MA67.)

    AE86 part numbers.
    90368-34049 | Front Pinion Bearing
    90368-30002 | Rear Pinion Bearing
    90368-41050 | Carrier Bearing (x2)
    90311-38015 | Pinion Seal
    90179-18001 | Pinion Nut ***
    41231-22010 | Crush Sleeve ***
    90311-52059 | Rear Axle Seals (x2) ***
    04421-30011 | Rear Axle Bearings (x2) ***


    Timken Part Numbers - Bearings & Seals.
    Key: *** means part # is same between MA46/MA47 and AE86.

    Timken Replacement part #'s found on www.timken.com in their catalogs.
    http://www.timken.com/en-us/products.../Catalogs.aspx (Bearing & Seal Application Catalogs.)

    MA46/MA47 & MA67
    17887 | Carrier Bearing Cone (bearing) - w/o LSD
    17831 | Carrier Bearing Cup (race) - w/o LSD
    32010X | Carrier Bearing Assy - w/LSD (Listed for MA67 F-series IRS Diff's)
    32307 | Pinion Bearing (inner)
    30306M | Pinion Bearing (outer)
    1177 | Pinion Seal
    514000 | Rear Axle Bearing ***
    1955 | Rear Axle Seal ***

    Tacoma/4-runner
    32010x | Carrier Bearing (No actual listing/part # in the timken catalog.) <-- Not 100% confirmed yet!
    I have measured ID & thickness of bearings on my old 4x4 tacoma front diff carrier (1.969"/50mm I.D. and .787"/20mm Wide). Using those measurements the following bearing should be the right one. At least from what I can tell.

    AE86
    SET 45 | Carrier Bearings (cone/race individually = LM102949/LM102910)
    HM88649 | Pinion Bearing cone (inner bearing)
    HM88610 | Pinion Bearing cup (inner race)
    M86649 | Pinion Bearing cone (outer bearing)
    M86610 | Pinion Bearing cup (outer race)
    1176S | Pinion Seal
    514000 | Rear Axle Bearing ***
    1955 | Rear Axle Seal ***


    Timken Bearing Dimensions.
    Pinion & Carrier Bearing Dimensions only (looked it up for comparison/verification).
    Dimensions from: http://www.timken.com/en-us/products.../Catalogs.aspx (Automotive Aftermarket Bearing Specification Guide - pg. 309 for numerical listing.)
    (Note: for all bearing width's refer to 'T' in timken catalog.)

    MA46/MA47 & MA67
    17887/17831 | Carrier Bearing Cone/Cup w/o LSD
    1.781" - I.D.
    3.149" - O.D.
    0.781" - Width

    32010X | Carrier Bearing Assy w/LSD
    1.969" - I.D.
    3.150" - O.D.
    0.787" - Width

    32307 | Pinion Bearing (inner)
    1.378" - I.D.
    3.150" - O.D.
    1.289" - Width

    30306M | Pinion Bearing (outer)
    1.181" - I.D.
    2.835" - O.D.
    0.817" - Width


    Tacoma/4-runner
    32010X | Carrier Bearing Assy w/LSD (Same as ^ MA46/MA47/MA67) <-- Not 100% confirmed yet!
    1.969" - I.D.
    3.150" - O.D.
    0.787" - Width


    AE86
    SET45 (LM102949/LM102910) | Carrier Bearings
    1.781" - I.D.
    2.891" - O.D.
    0.770" - Width

    HM88649/HM88610 | Pinion Bearing Cone/Cup (inner)
    1.375" - I.D.
    2.844" - O.D.
    1.000" - Width

    M86649/M86610 | Pinion Bearing Cone/Cup (outer)
    1.188" - I.D.
    2.531" - O.D.
    0.844" - Width
    Last edited by assassin10000; 07-23-2011 at 10:48 PM.

  4. #4
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    NIICE writeup, but a quick FYI my mk2 supra LSD was identical to the MK1 and went in with no fuss or muss.
    I am your 4ajesus

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by TTC View Post
    NIICE writeup, but a quick FYI my mk2 supra LSD was identical to the MK1 and went in with no fuss or muss.


    Thanks.

    To quote myself see #1 :
    Quote Originally Posted by assassin10000
    OEM/Aftermarket LSD options
    For the US market little or no Celica-Supras had an OEM lsd equipped, where as in Canada most did come with an OEM lsd.

    There are many more options for LSD available for the MA46/MA47 Celica-Supra than most realize, here's several I figured out. They ALL require using different carrier bearings with a larger bearing I.D. to fit the carrier (see bearing info below). They must also be for a 7.5" F-series toyota diff and designed for 27 spline axles.
    1. OEM clutch type LSD from MKII 82-86 Celica-Supra's
    2. OEM Torsen (gear) LSD from the 'JDM' Altezza (sxe10/gxe10)
    3. Any aftermarket (Cusco, Kaaz, Tomei, AT-S, ect) LSD for the Toyota Car 7.5" differential (Chassis codes IE: MA6x MKII Celica-Supra, JZX90 Chaser (non-turbo), SXE10/GXE10 JDM IS200 Altezza w/Beams)
    4. Any aftermarket Locker or LSD for the front of the Toyota 4x4 pickups & 4-runners. (IE: Detroit Truetrac torsen LSD, Detroit Locker, ARB air locker, Powertrax Lock-right & No-slip)
    Andrew
    Last edited by assassin10000; 07-10-2008 at 04:26 PM.
    1984 SR-5 (GT-S converted)
    1995 4x4 Tacoma
    Incomplete list of truck mods at
    http://www.parksoffroad.com/Our%20Ri...cab%20taco.htm

  6. #6
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    also: iv heard the altezza one works but its never been confirmed and none off the supra guys have used one.
    I am your 4ajesus

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by TTC View Post
    also: iv heard the altezza one works but its never been confirmed and none off the supra guys have used one.
    See #2.

    Also, I know that one of the guys at MA-motorsports used a ATS lsd in his mk1 rear axle swap... it was meant for an altezza. I think a handful of people on celicasupra.com have also used the OEM torsen LSD in their mkII's. AND I also confirmed the part #'s for the KAAZ lsd for the altezza is the same part for the MKII... which we've already determined is a drop in swap for the MKI, with the right size carrier bearings.

    Andrew
    Last edited by assassin10000; 07-11-2008 at 03:13 PM.
    1984 SR-5 (GT-S converted)
    1995 4x4 Tacoma
    Incomplete list of truck mods at
    http://www.parksoffroad.com/Our%20Ri...cab%20taco.htm

  8. #8
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    Awsome ima go order one nexzt year ;D
    I am your 4ajesus

  9. #9
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    EPIC write up. Very professional, and great source of information!

    Did you ever figure out those weld in frame connectors?
    SpeedHero

    Spirit of the Street, King of Sport

  10. #10
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    Nah. Interest petered out on the rear brace, if we sell the last 4 we might do some fender braces tho. I've already got a prototype to test out and i felt an amazing difference compared to the flat type .

    Andrew
    1984 SR-5 (GT-S converted)
    1995 4x4 Tacoma
    Incomplete list of truck mods at
    http://www.parksoffroad.com/Our%20Ri...cab%20taco.htm

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by assassin10000 View Post
    Tacoma/4-runner
    32010x | Carrier Bearing (No actual listing/part # in the timken catalog.) <-- Not 100% confirmed yet!
    I have measured ID & thickness of bearings on my old 4x4 tacoma front diff carrier (1.969"/50mm I.D. and .787"/20mm Wide). Using those measurements the following bearing should be the right one. At least from what I can tell.

    What measurements do you need for the 4runner diff?

    I have a ~2002-ish E-locker from a 4runner... would that be similar to what you mention above?

    (don't have the axle tube, just the diff/housing and axles)
    Last edited by Old 'Rollas; 07-11-2008 at 10:19 PM.
    Bryan
    DK Moderator




  12. #12
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    Nothing. The only place you would have to check fitment would be if you tried to use them IN a front IFS tacoma/4runner diff. In the other F-series diff's it won't be a problem afaik.

    Andrew
    1984 SR-5 (GT-S converted)
    1995 4x4 Tacoma
    Incomplete list of truck mods at
    http://www.parksoffroad.com/Our%20Ri...cab%20taco.htm

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