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Thread: Serendipity's comprehensive AE86 J160 swap

  1. #21
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    STEP 7: FINAL CONSIDERATIONS FOR CHAPTER 1: FITMENT


    Using a T50 Starter

    DISCLAIMER: if you choose to use a T50 starter, then make sure you have it rebuilt before you install it. Once installed with the SQ adapter, it'll be impossible to remove without dropping the transmission. Have a look why. It’s bolted to the adapter from the bellhousing side toward the engine:
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    Intake side starter
    As this option was impossible due to the waterline kit we've installed, we have no information for you on the ins and outs of this possibility.


    Upgrade to a Honda starter
    DISCLAIMER: If you want to use a Honda starter on LHD AE86s, you’ll need to have a manual steering rack, as there is not enough clearance otherwise. See below for more information.

    Having to drop the transmission in order to service the starter is no fun, so we bought the SQ Honda starter adapter and sourced a brand new starter. With this setup, we’ll be able to service the starter anytime without a huge fuss. It’s also, smaller, lighter, and as a gear reduction unit (1.2kw), more powerful than the direct drive T50 starter (0.8kw). Win win. In the SQ tech article, it states the following Honda engine code compatibility for AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSIONS ONLY:

    -F22A
    -F22B
    -F23A

    After some digging, we found that the F22B and F23A are only found on RHD Honda models (correct us i we're wrong), so if you’re in North America, the F22A starter would be easier to get. We found that the part number Mitsuba SM42228, is interchangable with the 1997-98 Honda Prelude, under the number, Mitsuba SM16960.

    As you can see, the Honda starter pinion comes out much further than the T50's, which is why the SQ adapter is so thick.
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    The area between the u-joint and the starter is as tight as a nun. Using a bolt with a smaller shoulder than the one supplied or an allen key bolt instead would do the trick. We were just able to slide a wrench over the bolt.
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    Now after seeing how little room there is with a manual rack, have a look at this next picture of my former power steering rack sitting next to my current manual rack. The size difference is why we believe it’s impossible to use the Honda starter setup with a power steering rack.



    The final test was done with the flywheel in place. Look ma! It works!!
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    Last edited by Serendipity; 04-28-2018 at 04:59 AM.

  2. #22
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    CHAPTER 2: FINISHING

    INDEX OF STEPS
    Step 1: Powder coating
    Step 2: Anodizing and plating
    Step 3: Painting



    Finishing work is my favourite step, and I like making parts look as close to OEM as possible by choosing colours and finishes that look good and last. While some find it cool to get parts in loud colour schemes, I prefer something more classic and subtle.


    Step 1: POWDER COATING
    Powder coating is a great finish, and I’ve had some success with it on parts from other projects. It looks good and stands up to attack from road debris. Unfortunately, on some parts like the SQ adapter plate and dust shield, the added thickness of the coating would probably cause headaches during assembly, so I opted to have them painted instead.

    Victoria Powder coating did a stellar job as usual. Here is the casing upon its arrival, through its metamorphosis and onto its finished appearance:
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    And here's a few project related parts from left to right: Driveshaft bearing shield, exhaust side engine to trans brace, J160 clutch fork, J160 and T50 output shaft dust shields, SQ trans crossmember
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    Last edited by Serendipity; 06-19-2018 at 01:57 PM.

  3. #23
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    STEP 2: ANODIZING AND PLATING

    PLATING:

    Seeing as how the bolts were lying around, I decided to have them Cadmium plated. The result was quite good:
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    The corrosion cleaned up nicely:
    Before plating:
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    After plating:
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    Anodizing
    Some of the parts are aluminum, which makes them ideal candidates for anodizing. No issues with added thickness here. Just raw beauty.

    More on this later...
    Last edited by Serendipity; 06-19-2018 at 01:59 PM.

  4. #24
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    Step 3: Painting
    Painting
    More on this later

  5. #25
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    CHAPTER 3: REASSEMBLY

    INDEX OF STEPS
    Step 1: Facking Toyota
    Step 2: Nissan S15 6th gear
    Step 3: Other simple mods
    Step 4: The final product


    Step 1: FACKING TOYOTA


    As the transmission was in good shape, we only needed to replace the input, output and shifter seals. All the bearings and synchros looked great. That was until we noticed that the rear countershaft bearing had some surface rust. No problem, let’s go to Toyota, right? Wrong...
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    First of all, I found the picture of the bearing in 33-05 of the Altezza parts diagram, but no part number was listed. Have a look, it tells you to go to diagram 33-02.
    33-05 Transmission Gear (MTM)
    http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/p_J_200...EFVF_3305.html

    Do you see it here either? I don't:
    33-02 Clutch Housing and Transmission Case (MTM)
    http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/p_J_200...EFVF_3302.html

    Well, as it turns out, you have to buy the entire case housing in order to get the bearing.

    Are you reading this Toyota?
    **** YOU...
    Thanks for that.

    According to Sam Q, it’s the same situation for the shifter end bushing and the middle shifter bushing.

    Carrying on, I decided to try and buy the bearing, # NTN 7E-HR 0620, and contacted the manufacturer. They won’t have stock until the fall.

    http://www.noc.ua/online-catalog-bea...7E-HR+0620+PX1

    As a last measure, I sent the bearing dimensions to Neil at Bullfrog. His supplier in California found a Nachi equivalent and it’s on the way. Bullfrog, saving the day, one transmission at a time.
    Last edited by Serendipity; 04-30-2018 at 03:46 AM.

  6. #26
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    Step 2: Nissan S15 5th gear

    Since I drive with a 4.778 Ring and Pinion, elevated highway RPM is an issue. With the second gen TeamMFactory 5th gear in my T50 (.737), I can cruise at around 3500RPM @110km/hr.

    The J160 has an even shorter 6th gear (.869) than the factory T50 5th gear (.861), so highway cruising @110km/hr with the OEM J160 6th gear would mean about 4000RPM. I can imagine how loud it would be with open velocity stacks on a road trip. Not cool.

    To make this transmission driveable on the highway, we sourced a set of used Nissan S15 6th gears (.767). Thisíll bring our highway cruising @110km/hr down to about 3600RPM. A little higher than what we have now with the MFactory gear set, but a huge improvement over what would have been if we had done nothing (3rd conditional).

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  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serendipity View Post
    Step 1: FACKING TOYOTA

    As the transmission was in good shape, we only needed to replace the input, output and shifter seals. All the bearings and synchros looked great. That was until we noticed that the rear countershaft bearing had some surface rust. No problem, let’s go to Toyota, right? Wrong...
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    First of all, I found the picture of the bearing in 33-05 of the Altezza parts diagram, but no part number was listed. Have a look, it tells you to go to diagram 33-02.
    33-05 Transmission Gear (MTM)
    http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/p_J_200...EFVF_3305.html

    Do you see it here either? I don't:
    33-02 Clutch Housing and Transmission Case (MTM)
    http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/p_J_200...EFVF_3302.html

    Well, as it turns out, you have to buy the entire case housing in order to get the bearing.

    Are you reading this Toyota?
    **** YOU...
    Thanks for that.
    While it is an absolute pisser that Toyota doesn't supply the bearing separately, diagram 33-05 doesn't say the bearing will be in diagram 33-02, it says the bearing isn't sold separately, you need to order the case, which is in diagram 33-02. From past experience, in this case, I actually think Toyota was being nice, usually they wouldn't say anything and you'd need to figure it out on your own, haha. (In fact, in the European IS200 J160 parts catalog, that is exactly how it is).

    Toyota/Subaru also don't list that bearing separately for the TL70, but I checked and Nissan does list it for the FS6R92A, part number is 32219-89F00. It sounds like you've got something coming that will likely work, but if not, this will probably get you sorted.

    Jeff

    2011 GSE20 Lexus IS350 6MT F-Sport with LSD
    2005 NCP13 Toyota Yaris RS 5MT Hatchback
    1993 TCR10 Team Mondor Toyota Previa GT-S RM 5MT Studded Ice Race Van
    1986 AE86 Toyota Corolla GT-S 5MT Supercharged

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lange View Post
    While it is an absolute pisser that Toyota doesn't supply the bearing separately, diagram 33-05 doesn't say the bearing will be in diagram 33-02, it says the bearing isn't sold separately, you need to order the case, which is in diagram 33-02. From past experience, in this case, I actually think Toyota was being nice, usually they wouldn't say anything and you'd need to figure it out on your own, haha. (In fact, in the European IS200 J160 parts catalog, that is exactly how it is).

    Toyota/Subaru also don't list that bearing separately for the TL70, but I checked and Nissan does list it for the FS6R92A, part number is 32219-89F00. It sounds like you've got something coming that will likely work, but if not, this will probably get you sorted.

    Jeff
    Jeff, thank you very much for this info. I'm going to look into the Nissan part numbers you supplied to corroborate. This is very much appreciated!

  9. #29
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    STEP 4: THE FINAL RESULT

    Well, it's been almost two months, but I finally have an update. We were able to source our rear counter shaft bearing from Mazda of all places...
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    Now that that's settled and the hardware has come back from plating, it was time to start reassembly. Neil at Bullfrog was kind enough to take some pictures of the trans, mid assembly:
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    Once assembled, it seemed like all the effort was worth it:
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    Kobe The Kind Helper Cat, snapped this last picture for us. The Toyota badge looks great:
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    The bad news is that the OEM J160 6th gears didn't survive removal, but the good news is that the Nissan S15 6th gear set was installed successfully! Can't wait to try them out.
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    Last edited by Serendipity; 06-19-2018 at 02:38 PM.

  10. #30
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    Glad you were able to get the bearing, Mazda was a good option as well.

    Jeff

    2011 GSE20 Lexus IS350 6MT F-Sport with LSD
    2005 NCP13 Toyota Yaris RS 5MT Hatchback
    1993 TCR10 Team Mondor Toyota Previa GT-S RM 5MT Studded Ice Race Van
    1986 AE86 Toyota Corolla GT-S 5MT Supercharged

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serendipity View Post
    STEP 4: THE FINAL RESULT
    Well, it's been almost two months, but I finally have an update. We were able to source our rear counter shaft bearing from Mazda of all places...
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    May i ask, what is Mazda's part number for this? I guess it's on sticker that is put on edge of box, but there seems only part of it readable. In search for NTN 7E-HR 0620 (for GT86 gearbox though. Same story with bearing listed by Toyota & Subaru (BRZ) only together with gearbox casing) ordered mentioned here Nissan part number 32219-89F00 (IIRC from Silvia S15 gearbox), but if it turns out for different bearing or takes too long, would love to find & order in parallel for known & tried alternative.
    Last edited by church; 07-03-2018 at 08:43 PM.

  12. #32
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    Seems i found right one by googling for mazda and last two complete portions of partnumber and finding for which found parts first portion ends with 2.
    So this countershaft bearing in my GT86 MT (probably same as BRZ/FR-S) differs from others only by it's 2-letter code of PU.
    Nissan's 32219-89F00 (which currently running in my gearbox) - WS. Mazda's Y602-17-306 - WU. To my uneducated eye all these NTN 7E-HR 0620 bearings seem same/interchangeable.
    Local mazda & nissan dealerships quoted no guaranteed delivery time and at tripple the prices for googled by part numbers, so it might be worth to buy online if no local stock (eg. i recieved very quickly for cheap Nissan's from amayama.com)
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  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by church View Post
    May i ask, what is Mazda's part number for this? I guess it's on sticker that is put on edge of box, but there seems only part of it readable. In search for NTN 7E-HR 0620 (for GT86 gearbox though. Same story with bearing listed by Toyota & Subaru (BRZ) only together with gearbox casing) ordered mentioned here Nissan part number 32219-89F00 (IIRC from Silvia S15 gearbox), but if it turns out for different bearing or takes too long, would love to find & order in parallel for known & tried alternative.
    Hi there. I’m sorry I didn’t get back to you sooner, I was checking with Bullfrog. They were just waiting for confirmation from their supplier on the part number. Looks like you beat me to the punch. Thanks very much!

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