Results 1 to 16 of 16

Thread: Wiring and Introductions

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11

    Wiring and Introductions

    Hello, I want to thank this board for existing and allowing me to join from down South. I've been stalking threads on here for a couple weeks looking for information I needed and have come across quite a bit but I still have some gaps to fill in regarding my project planning.

    My goal is to transplant a 3SGE Blacktop into my Triumph GT6 ('72). Besides the usual motor fitting and all that boring stuff that will only be relevant to myself I need some help with the wiring. Specifically how to fire the thing up.

    I'm still a bit away from this goal but I like to have a plan mapped out before I dive in. I've sourced the motor and trans, wiring harness (engine, with extra) dash pod and a complete ignition switch assembly. The only part I'm missing would be the under dash harness but I don't think I actually need it for this application.

    Technically I probably don't need the dash pod or ignition but I figured better to have and not need sort of scenario.

    I've been through several threads here and beyond about this issue. Most involve reading pin outs and diagrams (which I have possession of as well) and have been doing this but there seems to be some conflicting information out there.

    I suppose to start off my first question for everyone would be: 1) Having the dash & ignition, will this make the installation easier or is it a non issue. I had toyed with the idea of making the dash pod work in my Triumph with some physical modifications so that's not much of an issue for me.

    It seems this method would eliminate the wire hunting to some degree since I'll have the wiring in place as it should have been (adding in the necessary gaps connecting the dash to the ECU and ignition of course)

    Any thoughts would be appreciated.
    Last edited by Psevins; 07-04-2019 at 05:12 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Brampton, Ontario
    Posts
    1,488
    I have wired a few swaps and it's super easy, it just takes organisation and time. I haven't needed gauge clusters or ignition cylinders, but I've worked with older stuff that doesn't have immobilisers.

    Get yourself a good pair of strippers, asoldering gun and flux core lead solder (which is toxic). zipties, tape, loom, adhesive heat shrink, probably more stuff too.

    First identify all the wires that are 1)CONSTANT power 2) switched by ignition power and 3) ground. From here you may want to add a new circuit or two outside the factory fuse box as older cars didn't have many circuits, and they wern't at high load - adding your own two or three circuits makes your life easier, but the extra wiring may not be as tidy as you like. For the ignition switched power you may consider adding a relay.

    Choose a location for the computer and start plumbing. The chassis of the computer usually expects to be grounded, and the toyota igniters from the 80's and 90's also MUST be chassis grounded to work. There's excellent chances you will have to extend wiring, do it one wire at a time, I solder the joints and use adhesive heat shrink to seal them. It helps to have old toyota harness lying around because you can find similarly coloured wires to extend the harness with.

    Always connect your check engine light (MIL) to a light. you need a check engine light because you will make mistakes and the computer usually knows best what it's missing out on. You should be able to make your tachometer work by pirating the coil ground, or if it's inaccesable, borrowing IGT or IGF and running that signal into an amplifier circuit which is just a transistor and a broken relay.

    What make/model donated the PCM and harness, can you post your wiring diagrams? I love wiring cars and can offer much specific help.

    edit: aww sweet it's a BEAMS, I wired one of these in an RA20 celica once, good car. A bit of a pain because the wiring diagrams we found were a bit contradictory but it ran.
    Last edited by Sparkie; 07-04-2019 at 04:01 PM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    edit: aww sweet it's a BEAMS, I wired one of these in an RA20 celica once, good car. A bit of a pain because the wiring diagrams we found were a bit contradictory but it ran.[/QUOTE]

    Awesome, the engine is from a 2000 Toyota Altezza(blacktop beams). I've been studying the diagrams for awhile now and wow are there a lot of inconsistencies to the information out there! I've read that it only takes 3 wires to start it all the way to it takes the whole dash assembly to run it!

    I'll attach what I'm working with so you can see it and maybe provide a bit of clarity as I may have been looking at it took long and gone myopic on it!

    [U]Find the injectors and coils and trace back the POWER side of them and lead back to the fuse and battery
    i couldn’t find the stock ecu clip that goes into the E connector side of the ECU, but i did have a spare is300 dash harness that i cut and soldered female pins to tap into the ECU.
    heres what i got wired, yup 3 wires ran my beams engine nice and smooth!

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/4hhtxqbftd...nout.png?raw=1

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/02jk6g0hrv...gram.pdf?raw=1

    IGSW should be relayed to a ignition key switch source along with the coils and injectors and MAF sensor. the injectors and coil wires are found on the left over “junction clips”(refer to ecu pins print out) the ignition coils are B-W(black with white stripe) and injectors are B-R(black with red stripe) the MAF sensor is black and red(which is not the same wire as injectors, these are separate wires but same color, be careful), you will need to OHM out the wires end to end to see which is which, just to make sure that you don’t power up the wrong wires. find the “air flow meter” on the pinout and OHM out end to end(from map clip to ecu clip) B-R wires to double check you have the correct B-R wire. .
    E8, E16, and A6 is direct battery, fused!
    E10 RELAYED POWER
    BATT E1 is GROUND(dont make the same mistake i made and put power to it lol)
    [/U]


    To my eyes and mind it seems he contradicts himself inside this little paragraph but a lot of people have used his information to make it work so maybe I'm just not reading it in the right context.

    Basically my GT6 has 1 circuit and I'll be adding this as a 2nd with all its modern wiring and leaving the original as its own thing for the inside components and exterior lights.

    I'm not 100% ready to try and start it yet (waiting on a couple sensors that were broken on the motor to come in) but those should be in next week and then I just need to mock a temporary radiator and fuel delivery system.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    Here is my visualization of the above notes (I've included both ways I read it)

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/uj9q144d8i...%201.png?raw=1
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/m4ssjy7noi...%202.png?raw=1

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Brampton, Ontario
    Posts
    1,488
    A6 (+BM) is definitely unswitched battery power.

    The instructions you've quoted say to wire IG2 (injector and coil pack power) directly to the battery - that'd work fine however toyota wired them through the ignition switch so that killing the ignition would guarantee that no fuel or spark can be had. Your ignition switch sure as hell aint rated for that so you'll want a relay if you want that safety feature implemented.

    Also be mindful of the main relay - did you get it with your harness? It's gonna be an important part.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkie View Post
    A6 (+BM) is definitely unswitched battery power.

    The instructions you've quoted say to wire IG2 (injector and coil pack power) directly to the battery - that'd work fine however toyota wired them through the ignition switch so that killing the ignition would guarantee that no fuel or spark can be had. Your ignition switch sure as hell aint rated for that so you'll want a relay if you want that safety feature implemented.

    Also be mindful of the main relay - did you get it with your harness? It's gonna be an important part.
    My plan was to run any all of the injectors and coils off the ignition (on but not started) for that reason. I planned on also using relays for the ignition and any place else I thought would be prudent. The main relay, I'm going to say I didn't. I've got the harness from the motor that came with it and a backup harness with it as well but I have seen no relays. I have several new general purpose relays I should be able to use if this main relay is just that, a simple relay.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    And if your meaning the main fuel pump relay I'm using a whole after market fuel delivery system so it will be wired in separately.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    Had a few minutes at work today and drew this up based on what was mentioned and what I *think* I know. I haven't tested the wires yet to determine if E16 is Coils and E8 are injectors. Either way they essentially will be wired the same way.

    The only element left off this is the A6 connection. I'm confused on that one, its on the engine harness side (what I mean is its attached already to a connector in the harness).

    BTW the R in a box is a relay.
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Modified Diagram 2JP.jpg 
Views:	9 
Size:	461.5 KB 
ID:	15811

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Brampton, Ontario
    Posts
    1,488
    looks good

    just wire A6 through a fuse to battery positive. no switches or relays.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkie View Post
    looks good

    just wire A6 through a fuse to battery positive. no switches or relays.
    When you say wire A6 to 12v, I'm confused on how to achieve this becuase I can see 2 different ways and I'm sure 1 way would fry my ECU.

    See diagram below:
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20190711_165705.jpg 
Views:	8 
Size:	524.5 KB 
ID:	15812

    Basically do I send 12v through the ECU via pin A6 or do I send 12v through the wire coming out from A6 into the loom?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Brampton, Ontario
    Posts
    1,488
    That power goes right to the ECU, it needs it to run the electric sub throttle (i guess) from the fuse labelling.

    Also E1 will need a similar setup, off another fused 15A circuit.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkie View Post
    That power goes right to the ECU, it needs it to run the electric sub throttle (i guess) from the fuse labelling.

    Also E1 will need a similar setup, off another fused 15A circuit.
    Ok, makes sense. I've seen 2 conflicting notes about the E1 Pin, some claim it is a ground others say like you do to apply power to it. Its just a straight fused 12v no switch control (ie always on so to speak?)

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Harness 071219_small.jpg 
Views:	9 
Size:	86.6 KB 
ID:	15813

    Something like this then?

    I've also been assuming (hopefully Im correct) E10, E16, E8 all are sending power to the ECU from my wiring correct?

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Brampton, Ontario
    Posts
    1,488
    e1 and a6 should have separate 15a fuses, but yeah, alwAYs on, direct to battery


    ---edit:

    I had a flash of clarity on the ****ter: your confusion regarding E1: the E1 we're talking about is pin 1 of connector "E" (hence E1) but the signal name attached to that is "BATT"

    here's where it gets crazy:" the signal name "E1" is pin 17 of connector "B" is ground; and indeed there are signals (pin in brackets): E2 (B18), E01 (A21), E02 (A31), EC (E15), ME01 (A8) and GE01 (A9) that are all battery ground (- terminal or "0V")
    Last edited by Sparkie; 07-12-2019 at 03:49 PM. Reason: schematics are hard sometimes.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkie View Post
    e1 and a6 should have separate 15a fuses, but yeah, alwAYs on, direct to battery


    ---edit:

    I had a flash of clarity on the ****ter: your confusion regarding E1: the E1 we're talking about is pin 1 of connector "E" (hence E1) but the signal name attached to that is "BATT"

    here's where it gets crazy:" the signal name "E1" is pin 17 of connector "B" is ground; and indeed there are signals (pin in brackets): E2 (B18), E01 (A21), E02 (A31), EC (E15), ME01 (A8) and GE01 (A9) that are all battery ground (- terminal or "0V")
    That just brought so much clarity to my mind

    The next step will be to clarify my wiring notes to make sure I haven't got anything backwards.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    11
    Finally found a source for the plug I needed to go into the ECU and its on its way. Once I have that I should be able to test this thing out to at least see if I can get it to turn over.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •